NO2ID - 5 comments
No dissenting voices?
In that case, we're backing:
I'd still put myself in the camp that argues that ID cards and the "database state" are not wrong in principle, and that perfect machines and intelligent systems could liberate us from bureaucracy and form-filling, replace all our various cards and documents with one magic card, and so much more. I suspect something like this will evolve over the next decades, but it sure as hell won't be anything like the nightmare that's planned at the moment, for the reasons spelt out here, and on so many blogs.
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5 comments so far...
It's disgrace. I have worked for the Labour Party for 30 years and I feel passionately in favour of ID cards to fight crime for the working class - i.e. us. Its a party commitment, and at our CLP, loyal and decent to a man, we are solidly for it.
Expense is not an issue, it's perfectly sustainable over time. And so far the card proposal don't go far enough. I hope the cards can be built into a comprehensive surveillance system for the UK, logging the movements of anyone suspicious 24 hours a day. The technology is expanding for this all the time.
You have nothing to fear. I am shocked at your disloyalty to the party and, more importantly, working class communities mired in crime.
A disgrace. Where are your balls? Eaten by the liberals I suspect.
Loyalty doesn't come into it - if I loyally backed a policy I didn't believe in and which proved a disaster, I'd rightly feel some responsibility. As the omens are so bad, I don't want to do anything that brings the ID project closer to realisation.
Expense is not an issue, it's perfectly sustainable over time.
From the NO2ID document: "The Government has not ventured figures for the cost to the country as whole of the identity management scheme. That makes evaluation difficult. Civil Service IT experience suggests current projections are likely to be seriously underestimated. Home Office figures are for internal costs only, and have risen sharply - where they are not utterly obscure. Industry estimates suggest that public and private sector compliance costs could easily be double whatever is spent centrally."
a comprehensive surveillance system for the UK, logging the movements of anyone suspicious 24 hours a day.
That's unbelievable. Suspicious according to whom? Where does it end? "The Home Office seeks wide discretion over the future shape of the scheme. There are more than 30 types of regulatory power for future Secretaries of State. These could be used to change the functions and content of the system ad lib. The scope, application and possible extension are extra-parliamentary decisions, even if nominally subject to approval."
The technology is expanding for this all the time.
Leaving aside the biometrics, "The Home Office scheme combines untested technologies on an unparalleled scale. Its many inchoate purposes create innumerable points for failure. The government record with computer projects is poor, and the ID system is likely to end up a broken mess."
You have nothing to fear.
I wouldn't even know if I did! That makes it hard to judge the question rationally.
working class communities mired in crime.
It's a problem, but where's the evidence ID can solve it? "ID does not establish intention. Competent criminals and terrorists will be able to subvert the identity system. Random outrages by individuals canât be stopped. Ministers agree that ID cards will not prevent atrocities."
Where are your balls? Eaten by the liberals I suspect.
"Balls" might come into it if we/the government really knew better than all the experts, bloggers, and ordinary people who have exposed flaws in the ID plan and had to force through an essential policy against irrational arguments, but I believe this is an issue for the brain.
Yes, I'm a liberal - liberals try to guarantee everyone's freedom, even if other people would - voluntarily or under duress - surrender them.
The only thing I can add to Andrew's succinct summary of the case against ID cards (an more importantly the proposed database) in this form is the issue of witness protection. If everyone will have an ID card in the end and these will be linked to a central biometric database, how will people given new identities by the state ever be safe? Prof. Ross Anderson (Information Security expert) has said that iris scans can be taken from a telephoto lens photograph, other biometrics such as feature recognition and fingerprints might be even easier to obtain.
How long will it be before data entry clerks are blackmailed, or a Sun journalist!, accesses the database. One cross reference of biometrics would show where the witness with the new identity lived.
All of which is a long-winded way of saying that the "balls", which might give us the determination to fight crime, must be linked to a liberal "brain", which gives us the means to do so whilst preserving our cherished liberties.
"The Home Office scheme combines untested technologies on an unparalleled scale. Its many inchoate purposes create innumerable points for failure. The government record with computer projects is poor, and the ID system is likely to end up a broken mess."
Yes, we need to test those untested technologies by use of comprehesive ID card and 24hour system for the UK. Sure they will be some failures at first, but a gradual tweaking process means we will get it right in the end.
Let's get the ball rolling now. It has to be linked to 24hour surveilliance of the whole population - including in workplaces and homes.
This should be linked to GPS, the police, army and powerful weaponry, such as stun guns, so if a terrorist is identified, or other criminals, they can swiftly apprehended or killed if necessary.
Will reduce crime too - with nationwide total surveillance linked to the full police and army etc, ready to pounce at a seconds notice, burglars would think twice.
Oh, I see - the master satirist. You really should be on Channel 4. All I can say is that it's your time you're wasting.
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